You’re NICked…

First of all let me declare an interest : I spent the best part of the last 20 years of my working life as a self employed contractor in the IT industry. I’m also a chartered accountant so I was particularly interested in what the Chancellor had to say yesterday about National Insurance contributions.

There’s been a lot of nonsense spouted by various self employed people over yesterday’s announcement, not least of all by one particular blogger – whose blog I’m banned from accessing – that I read this morning (working well, that ban, isn’t it?) who simply doesn’t seem to understand the situation at all, frankly. However, in the interests of fairness, you can read his slant on all this here even if I’m not allowed to! (sic.)

What the Chancellor has done is to abolish Class 2 NICs and incorporate that saving into the Class 4 NIC. The Class 4 NIC has then been increased by 1% this year and a further 1% next year.

The bleat from the people who don’t like this seems to revolve around around their employment rights. The self employed have no employment rights, so the argument is irrelevant. The government provide the NHS and a state pension in return for NI. Here’s an important point : The State Pension has been changed so that self employed people now have the same pension rights as employees. They also have the same access to the NHS, so why should they pay less?

Even after these changes, the self employed still pay a lower NI contribution that employees whilst getting the same access to the NHS and the same pension rights. Employees pay 12% compared to the current Class 4 rate of 9%. Over £43,000 p.a. everyone pays 2%.

The net effect of the changes is that self employed people earning under £28,000 per annum will pay less NI. From £28,000 to £43,000 they will pay the same. Over £43,000 they will pay more.

This seems fair to me. Maternity rights, sick pay and paid holidays are not the responsibility of the government. When I worked as a self employed contractor, I earned more than I would have done as an employee. This was precisely because I had to earn enough to cover unpaid holidays, sickness, gaps between contracts and the like.

There is a class of people in this country and others who believe that things should be given to them as a right and that they shouldn’t have to contribute in order to get them. My fellow blogger’s rant calling the government ‘thieving scum’ and the taxman a ‘blood sucking leech’ shows a fundamentally bad attitude and is typical of the ‘something for nothing’ mentality. I won’t bother to argue the case with him because that would be like trying to teach a pig to sing.

The case for this change is clear. It’s about fairness. If you want the same rights, then you should pay the same contributions towards them. And, at the end of the day, nobody forces you to become self employed. It’s a choice for you as it was for me and I fail to see why there should be a financial incentive funded by employed people for you to do so…


16 responses to “You’re NICked…

  1. rapscallion

    However Dioclese, the person to whom you are referring to (and well know who that is), is entirely wrong is he?

    Bear with me if you will for a moment. The Government , which is far too large and consumes too much of OUR effing money, is a wasteful dispenser of OUR money. It chucks 12bn of it to other countries (hello, I didn’t get a f*cking say in that), and also chucks gawd knows how much dosh at NGO’s, Charidees, and other useless hangers on – like the effing Lords.. He who must not be mentioned raises a valid point when (and I quote loosely from memory) that instead of reducing the amount of borrowing it should be looking to reducing its spending) When you’re in debt you should not be looking to increase spending FFS.

    Personally I don’t see why the self-employed can’t have a bit of leeway. They don’t get paid holidays, or paid sick leave etc. Either they work or they don’t eat. Coming out with the pensions and NHS shit is just muddying the waters. Even the feckless oxygen thieves get access to the NHS for free. As ever, its the self-employed who contribute so much in the way of tax to the government in the first place – and most of pissed up against the wall by said government on fuc*ing oxygen thieves. And now they want MORE.

    And, yes the government of whatever stripe are thieving scum and the tax man IS a blood sucking leech. All they do is take money from me with state sponsored violence and incarceration if I don’t cough up the protection money.

    You should add them to your “is a cunt” blogroll

    • I would hope you do know to whom I am referring as I did give a link to his contra-view in the piece I wrote. He’s entitled to his opinion even though I disagree with it. That why I linked to it, so that both sides of the argument could be examined and people could draw their own conclusions.

      Secondly, I fully agree with your assessment of the foreign aid budget. I would point out that it was the Lib Dems who forced this on the coalition as a condition of forming a government. They insisted on a percentage of GDP and the government has been scrubbing round to find people to give it to. It really should have been repealed after the last election. Thank you, Mr Clegg!

      Thirdly, it’s not the self employed who contribute the most in tax take to the Revenue, and in any case we’re talking NI here not Income Tax. As a previously self employed person and a qualified accountant, I would state quite categorically that the percentage tax take on the self employed is absolutely less than for employees. Fact.

      You are getting leeway. You pay less tax and NI than employees. Fact.

      Fourthly, if you read my piece again, I covered your argument about paid holidays, sick days, etc. Your entitlement to Pensions and the NHS is EXACTLY the same as for employees. This is not muddying the waters, again it is FACT.

      Your attitude is similar to Longriders. If we all took that approach there’d be no money to pay for anything because we’d all want to get benefits without paying anything towards them and there’s be no benefits to be had.

      The truth is often inconvenient. Nobody likes paying taxes, but like it or not, they are necessary.

      And, for the record, I am no longer associated with “…is a cunt”

      • Fair enough, but it makes little difference to me whether the money they swipe before I even see it is called tax or NI – its still my money in their pocket. I accept that we all have to pay for the services that the government provides, but there is far too much of it, and most of it doesn’t work well, or is badly run or misused. (Foreigners being treated here without being forced to pay) That money should be used for things like Defence, Civil Service, Departments of State etc. The NHS is a different matter – but I’ll say for now that we could a lot more bang for our buck.

        The real point here is that government has to keep on raising money because is misspends it so badly. The curve is ever upwards, never downwards – and that’s going to be a really big problem.

        Shame you’re no longer associated with “… a cunt”

      • Can’t disagree with your penultimate pars! Zero based budgetting is a concept the civil service just can’t seem to grasp.

        There’s a new team at ISAC who are doing a great job. I did it for nearly three years and it was time to move on…

  2. I still can’t get my head round that these supposedly intelligent and clever people that expect us to believe they can produce a budget for the country to work can borrow money, pay interest on it to then give it away. Perhaps I’m just a bit old fashioned?

    • I agree. The aid budget is lunacy – see my reply to rapscallion above.
      We need to put our own country first – something we could perhaps learn from President Trump?

      Having said that, borrowing money to invest in infrastructure generates jobs and boosts the economy.

  3. Just took another read of Longriders blog to see the latest on this issue. He makes a good point about inheritance tax. It is an abomination. You pay tax all your life and then they tax you for dying on what’s left. Appalling!

    However, there is a commenter, Stephen, who disagrees with what is being said. He’s insulted as a ‘ drive by troll’ and told he has no credibility. I know the feeling. I suggest he comes here where I might disagree with him but would not block him or disrespect his opinion.

    This sort of arrogance seemingly knows no bounds and does bloggers no credit imho…

    • . . . which is to your credit Dioclese. I was banned from that wanker Pete North’s blog because I disagreed with him about veterans (being one myself)

      • I’m blocked from Longrider because I disagreed with his views on Cuba. I wrote a piece on here about agreeing to disagree that sums up my attitude…

        Mind you, I don’t have any trouble getting round his block as you might have gathered. 20 years in IT taught me a few tricks!

  4. The LR link brings up a message, “Error establishing a database connection”.
    Have you hexed him?

  5. I haven’t been able to access LR all day, either.

  6. Kudos for showing both sides of the arguement. I’m still “Making my mind up”

    • I do accept that different people hold different views and try to show both sides. I maintain I have a right to disagree and grown ups should be able to disagree amicably. Some people are, regrettably, unable to do so…

      • I see from this morning’s blocked blog that our friend is back to his favourite line of attack for people who are not as brilliant and all knowing and uber intelligent as him. This really boils my piss! Here it is in full :

        Quote – “I see that we are not supposed to refer to people as being drive-by-trolls and lacking in credibility when they spatter contrary comments full of logical fallacies and don’t bother with engaging when challenged – even when it is factually true. Oh, dear, well, that’s me told, then ain’t it?

        Now, how long shall I spend worrying about it?


        Er, no, just can’t do it 😉

        FFS – I know nothing and am full of logical fallacies! Eighteen professional examinations over 5 years and I still have no idea what I’m talking about. And I tried engaging. He was brutally offensive and when I failed to bow to his obvious intellectual superiority, he called me a troll and blocked me from his blog.

        How very grown up!